This episode demonstrates again what Anthony and his followers at wattsupwiththat.com (WUWT) are really like underneath their charade of climate science denial. It's not the first time Anthony Watts has shown he has no class and is incapable of empathy. In the past he has seized on a disastrous tragedy, Haiyan, and used it as an opportunity for another attack on science. And if you decide to read the WUWT comments, you'll see that denial goes hand in hand with the bigotry of some deniers.
Shame on them.
Update: Dr Roy Spencer PhD tops the efforts of Anthony Watts and most of the deniers at WUWT. See the comments below for details, or read what he wrote on his Facebook page.
Sou 11:15 am 15 November 2015
[Note: Out of respect for the victims of the terrorist attacks in Paris, and their families, and all of France, I postponed the publication of this article for a few hours. If you do comment, I know you'll remember that this blog is viewed by people from around the world, and will respect those who've been touched by the horrific events in Paris.]
Don't forget the asinine and idiotic responses from the right-wing nutters after 9/11 and the anti-french rhetoric which even included no more "french fries". Opportunists will always seek a platform to add their screed to the escalating crescendo of noise. They're not interested in decency, human rights or respect. They'll seize this "opportunity" to spew more of their stupidity and arrogance. Watts is scum and he caters to scum, fools and idiots.
ReplyDeleteThere's been big news on the climate front, but this is a time for mourning. What happened in France is horrible and the whole world should contemplate the terrible losses and pain inflicted. This will be France's 9/11 event and like what happened here, what happens next politically or culturally will not be good.
One of Watts' headlines concerning Haiyan:
ReplyDeleteSuper Typhoon Haiyan/Yolanda – another overhyped storm that didn’t match early reports
Yeah, only 7300+ dead or missing from that one. Nothing to see here, move along. What a pitiful excuse for a human being, is he :-\
And now, of course, he's hoping this latest terrorist disaster will kill COP21. That's all that really concerns him about this tragedy, and he's quite transparent about it. Amazing.
The self-absorption of Watts and his ilk borders on the pathological.
ReplyDeleteNow we have the nauseating prospect of Monckton and his circus 'braving' the perils of Paris to thwart the designs of evil people - aka honest scientists.
With some exceptions WUWT and its regulars reacted predictably.
ReplyDeleteAnd those are the only words I'll waste on them.
There is form on this
ReplyDeletehttp://judithcurry.com/2015/01/11/charlie-challenging-free-speech/
Nous sommes tous Parisiens.
Vive la France!
Anthony sure has got some sick puppies in his 'care'. These people have been intellectually debilitated by obsessive loathing...one would be happy if COP delegates were attacked and killed by such terrorists, another insists Obama will spin this for CC...irony is dead
ReplyDeleteFor a really sick person, look no further than Roy Spencer PhD on his facebook page, writing a worse than appalling article referring to the events in Paris. He closes with this unambiguous wish:
ReplyDeleteYes, all of the world’s politicians who have supported a COP21 agreement should still plan on attending. And they should reach out to ISIS to join them in building a better world…a world without droughts.
In fact, in solidarity with the gun-control measures many of those politicians support (and which French law follows), any personal security personnel accompanying them should be unarmed.
Yikes! That's vile.
DeleteHere's a link to a screenshot of Roy's full article.
DeleteThat ought to get him dismissed. That, and his determination to mislead people with his unreviewed data set on his wretched blog, the kind of calculatedly disinforming 'outreach' that should not sit comfortably with UAH and NASA.
DeleteJesus f****** Christ, that's unbelievable.
DeleteOnce the mask slips like that it can't ever be put back on. It's almost unfathomable. That will color any comment of his I ever read again.
It makes me wonder if one reason that Spencer has spent so many years downplaying the risks that climate change may pose to hundreds of millions of people is that he has sociopathic tendancies.
I'm entirely serious. Experts such as the University of British Columbia's Robert Hare have estimated that sociopaths (or psychopaths, Hare's preferred term) constitute about 1% of the population, with significantly higher incidences among prison inmates, white collar criminals and corporate executives.
To quote a book Spencer claims to follow: "...for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness."
DeleteAt many institutions a screed like Spencer's would have that staff member immediately suspended for bringing the institution into disrepute, and in some would almost certainly see a summary dismissal based on contractual obligations. Universities tend to be a bit more liberal in this regard, but I suspect that our institution Spencer would have been referred to the ethics and research integrity division for consideration and counselling.
DeleteAt the least. It's quite possible that such a staff member would become redundant to requirements...
Seriously, I think these "atmospheric physicists" such as Richard Lindzen, Judith Curry, and Roy Spencer are becoming completely discredited.
DeleteI
There isn't a single mention of Ted Kaczynski.
DeleteSo we can be thankful that Dr Spencer isn't politicizing the science.
The new Morano movie ought to set everyone straight.
Starring, among others:
Professor Judith Curry,
Professor Richard Tol
William Briggs
and Patrick Moore.
They're just askin' the tough questions, ya know?
They're just calliin' it as they see it, ya know?
In Dr. Spencer's view, he was just minding his own business and making some sarcastic remarks which "got people’s panties in a wad" but he won't link to that "craziness".
DeleteThat little 'rationalisation' shows Spencer is mind-bogglingly stupid....really, there is no other conclusion that can be drawn.
DeleteHe is of the view that if the French could bear arms a la Texas, the situation would be different....hmmm, I can just see handguns in crossfire in the Bataclan really reducing the danger. And a society saturated with personal arms has really worked out well in the US, as we all know...
Spencer is a dimwit:
"Funny how the most powerful gun control advocates have no problem with using guns to protect themselves."
The level of aggressive oblivion needed to publish a brainfart like this is pretty high.
UAH really should let him go... do they still really need evidence-denying idiots like him around campus?
I just asked him: Do @UAHuntsville & @NASA support your using the #ParisAttacks to spread Islamophobia? That bigotry is what the terrorists want.
DeleteEveryone knew Roy Spencer's article was dripping with sarcasm, but it was that which gave him away. And he's right. It was the last couple of paragraphs which were most illuminating and shocking. Roy Spencer didn't say anything in his reply that indicated it doesn't represent his wishes.
DeleteAs for his "imagine in Texas" - I shudder to think of the carnage if every US citizen was armed to the teeth. The number of people who die from guns in the USA is horrific, and I know that many, many people there want to change the situation.
Roy Spencer's rationalisation suggests that he *does* understand that he's painted himself in the same light as religious fundamentalist extremists the world over. He is unapologetic. A gun-toting religious nut is a dangerous creature.
The ABC reported this morning that there was a gathering in Paris today where fireworks were let off. People panicked and started "yelling and screaming" and when police in attendance themselves panicked and drew their firearms the crowd stampeded.
DeleteImagine such a situation where people were drawing out their firearms Taxas style, and pointing them at the nearest not-white person...
Vile indeed. Islamophobic as well: apparently "strict followers of the Koran" believe in killing anyone who stands in their way. As an evangelical Christian, I guess Roy would regard himself as pretty "strict" about biblical authority (i.e. not like those wishy washy liberal Christians) , so he would appear to be talking about his "opposite numbers" in Islam, as opposed to some fringe violence-obsessed sect.
ReplyDeleteFinally, his logical faculties really have gone missing now. Apparently if someone suggests that the violence in Syria has been exacerbated by an AGW-induced drought, that logically implies that all terrrorism is caused by climate change.
It's time Prof Curry called this particular "Advocate Scientist" out.(Irony alert)
He's wrong about how strict followers of the Koran interpret it. Religious followers are not the same as the ideological fundamentalist terrorists, who are politically not religiously motivated.
DeleteI agree with you, Bill. Roy's article shows him (Roy) to be no different to fundamentalist terrorists the world over, no matter what religion they try to hide behind.
Bill H has preempted a quick quiz that I was going to pose...
DeleteWhose motivations are based not on best understanding of facts and of best outcome for a maximum of others and for the planet, but on their own personal ideologies?
Who deliberately or ignorantly misinterprets, misrepresents, and/or misunderstands the material that they present in order to further their personal ideological objectives?
Who does not care about the future of planet or its biodiversity and unborn generations, and would happily prosecute their own agendas regardless of any amount of damage to such?
Who uses the public fear created by their ideological misrepresentation of things in order to prevent a better outcome for all, simply because doing so conflicts with their ideology?
There are at least three answers to such a quiz, and I suspect that those who fit into one or more of such answers would, in their logical fallaciousness, get even these answers wrong...
I work closely with an aide who is a strict Muslim. Believe me, she is not for violence.
DeleteAlso, a gas station attendant whom I chat with from time to time, is now afraid. It was unlike him and brought me up short. And he's right, the hate will grow and hurt.
Spencer's Koranic exegesis has emerged from the US Religious Right over the last few decades, and is one that was missed by Muslims for over a millenium. Only white people can accurately interpret texts, it seems.
DeleteA pity nobody noticed this before the US, Pakistan and the Saudis armed a pack of medievalists because they were fighting the Soviets. But then strict followers of Das Kapital believe in killing anyone in their way, doncha know.
Please, we need to recognise the falsehood of the linkage that some people are claiming between AGW/Syrian drought and the rise of Da'esh.
ReplyDeleteThe drought in the Syrian jazeera commenced around 2006. Coincidentally, around the same time elements of the ex-Baath military and al-Qaeda began to get together in Iraq, to eventually form ISI (Islamic State of Iraq). However much people like Dick Cheney might deny it, Da'esh is a product of the US invasion and occupation of Iraq.
The economic downturn caused by the Syrian drought undoubtedly contributed to the civil discontent that erupted in early 2011. Within a month, however, armed groups took the leading role in anti-government action. Initially domestic, such as Muslim Brotherhood cells, these groups were rapidly augmented and resourced from outside, notably from certain neighbours on the Arabian Gulf.
ISI had been under considerable pressure in Iraq due the the 'Surge' and the efforts of the Maliki government to suppress it. In short, it moved into Syria in the latter part of 2011 to establish a potential safe haven , and found the fragmented situation there offered security and fertile ground for further expansion. David Kilcullen's Quarterly Essay, 'Blood Year', is a good article for deeper explanation and argument.
Given the lies that some denialists appear to be gleefully putting into the media to take advantage of the Paris situation, we need to have our facts correct to refute them.
That is quite a fair summary of the situation.
DeleteI-beam
DeleteI second your recommendation of David Kilcullen's writing.
Here is a You Tube interview
As their claims crash and burn, the climate deniers become increasingly desperate and show their true colors.
Spencer is invoking the Heartland gambit.
I don't get this. Absent a harsh drought in Syria, it would have been hard for ISIS to append the 'S' to their name, as you argue eloquently. So your claim that the link is "false" is refuted by your own argument is it not?
DeleteThe displacement of conservative rural families to the cities must have contributed to the social breakdown. This was unlike the usual migration to the cities due to population growth, or a temporary expedient that might get you through a bad year, but families actually losing their land. That's a traumatic dislocation for any family, but when concentrated it's disastrous. Since they have no support network, anyone can step in and provide one, real or not.
DeleteWithout this migration the rural population might well have stay secular urbanites. Sadly we'll never know. What we see is what we've got.
Should be "might well have stayed out of the revolt leaving it to secular urbanites".
DeleteWhatever the realtive contributions in the unfathomable ætiology of the Syrian mess and of the growth of IS, it is undeniable that a global warming-enhanced drought exacerbated it, and that decades of Western interference in the Middle East provided a large part of the impetus to initiate it.
DeleteThink forward 50 to 100 years, when the effects of climate change are profoundly worse, and the non-First World knows full-well that the First World is largely responsible for the mess, that they got rich from making it, and that they did so on the backs of the rest of the world.
I suspect that what is happening today will pale into comparison to future frustration and zealotry inflamed by our continuing colonial attitude to the rest of the planet. The really scary thing is that some of those folk now have the power of the atom...
No. By the second half of 2011, social order had been weakened, if not broken down in many areas of Syria due to to conflict-related factors. These included armed uprisings in some parts (notably the north west), the relocation of army resources nearer areas of conflict, and local religious groups and gangs (eg the smugglers that operated in many areas near the Turkish border) taking up arms.
DeleteAlso remember that Da'esh initially infiltrated the jazeera as a benign, non-threatening entity, setting up small charitable centers in towns, while they sussed out potential allies and enemies. Raqqa was only taken over by rebels in early 2013; Da'esh didn't oust the other rebel groups and Syrian Army forces, and finally take sole control of Raqqa until August 2013.
"civil discontent that erupted in early 2011. Within a month, however, armed groups took the leading role in anti-government action."
DeleteNot exactly. March 2011, regime shot at civil demonstrations.
July 2011, a number of army officers defected and began the FSA. Of course, at that moment the resistance was armed resistance.
There was already a lot of 'sleeping violence' following the destruction of Hama in 1982, too, which Assad awakened instantly in March '11.
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
DeleteFor a while there I thought you were a genuine contributor. Maybe a bit off the wall at times, but yet... though now, I can see you were just a concern troll all along. Sad that it comes to that.
DeleteThanks MM. Sorry about the comment and link. I didn't check it out and should have.
DeleteThere is no place for that sort of nonsense here at HW - now deleted.
No one is claiming that the Syrian drought brought ISI into existence, but like you said, it is a potential factor that aided its success. Consequences of global warming (drought, water shortage, etc) will not cause terrorism, they will fertilize it. AGW is an amplifier of crises already there.
ReplyDeleteBTW, Spencer truly is a sociopath.
Well, Roy Spencer just strikes me as a typical right-wing nutjob, but with a PhD. RWNJs are perpetually angry at everything, and Obama in particular incites them into a white-hot rage.
DeleteSpencer does rate a short article in the invaluable Encyclopedia of American Loons: http://americanloons.blogspot.com/2013/01/367-roy-spencer.html
DeleteThe preceding "unknown" comment was mine, by the way. I hit the button before adding my nom de web.
Without wishing to be annoying, but is this page also doing what WUWT is doing? Using this tragedy to bolster their own side of the argument by pointing out how bad the other side are for using these murders? Maybe the most humane thing would have been for all you in the blogosphere just to just give your condolences and and show solidarity with the victims.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteActually, I don't think that the WUWT post was that offensive. The comment about Obama's priorities was bad taste, but overall I think it would have been more dignified to simply let it pass. As Penny59 points out, the victims in Paris deserve our attention now.
DeleteRoy Spencer's FB comment, however, is on a different level. That was truly atrocious.
Yes, once you've become inured to the nastiness of the WUWT commentariat, their rantings barely seem offensive at all. But if, like me, you haven't been there for a while, you'll start to feel dirty from just being there.
Delete"
DeleteWithout wishing to be annoying, but is this page also doing what WUWT is doing? Using this tragedy to bolster their own side of the argument by pointing out how bad the other side are for using these murders?
"
No. There is no "argument" here. There is no "other side".
Sou is merely commenting on the fact that Watts and Spencer are willing to "use" these Paris killings for their cause in the first place.
If the denialists actually were making an argument, we'd see some claims and evidence and logical inference to the most probable explanation. What they offer is ridiculous, tasteless. tangential, politically charged rhetoric.
"
Maybe the most humane thing would have been for all you in the blogosphere just to just give your condolences and and show solidarity with the victims.
"
Calling out ideological stupidity is not disrespectful.
Unfortunately, it's necessary.
People will die from the effects of rapid climate change just as surely as they have from bullets.
The failure of civic society in Syria, the ensuing civil war and the rise of ISIL are caused by much more than the local climate change. Before an extreme drought destroyed the agricultural infrastructure to the point where the population would starve without extensive government subsidy for the displace millions there were many other contingent factors involved.
ReplyDeleteThe political theocracy of the DAESH movement emerged out of the post-war chaos of Iraq. That was the result of the American overthrow of Saddam. An autocratic ruler the US had put in place to exclude communists from influence in a artificially constructed nation State that was intended to enclose conflicting groups. The British empire found that ruling a region in which the inhabitant would fight each other rather than combining to fight the colonial power was always a good strategy. Pre-dating all that is the Islamic schism between Sunni and Shiite that underlies the extreme iconoclastic puritanism of the salafist groups.
So making a close association between the ideologically driven atrocities of people from this complex history and disparaging the ongoing efforts to deal with contributory factor of climate change would be selective use of that atrocity to further a separate agenda.
Pointing out when a person or group has indulged in that dubious practices does not mean that you have committed a similar sin.
The underlying cause of what is happening throughout the ME is overpopulation. Its frightening when you look at the population statistics.
DeleteFor example Egypt, whose military is trying to keep the lid on another insurgency:
1986 - 48 million
1996 - 59 million
2006 - 73 million
2013 - 84 million
Things like drought, economic problems, or venal politicians invading to steal some oil wells for their fossil fuel industry puppetmasters, act like whacking an unexploded bomb with a sledgehammer.
@-Millicent
Delete"The underlying cause of what is happening throughout the ME is overpopulation. Its frightening when you look at the population statistics."
But on the other hand during the time from 1986 to the present when the population has almost doubled the GDP per capita has more than doubled. Twice as many people are now twice as rich as they were before.
It is not that the population is oversized, but the ongoing ability to keep that enlarged population in the improved conditions to which they have become accustomed is threatened.
Or to gain the better conditions in the West to which they feel entitled.
There's a complex whole of several factors that leads to historic events, always, but most revolutions are ignited when the price of bread has become the straw that breaks the camel's back.
DeleteAnd this is just the AGW factor at its beginning. The future risk is that its role will become more dominant.
The Egyptian junta is spending a lot more time trying to keep the lid on moderate political opposition that might threaten its business interests, than on fighting terrorists. The effect of course is to breed terrorists.
DeleteTheir revolution was also initially sparked by food prices and spread to a broader movement fed up by the corruption and repression.
Unfortunately the revolution failed. The new government is awful.
The stability of a country is not determined by how many rich people a country has, but by how many poor people it has. A high birthrate exacerbates inequality - the highest birthrate is not among the educated, westernised part of the population.
Delete+1 Millicent.
DeleteAnd on a space- and resource-constrained planet, that stability decreases exponentially with the increase in numbers of people in poverty and disadvantage.
"stability decreases exponentially with the increase in numbers of people in poverty and disadvantage."
DeleteThat's it in a nutshell. The price their labour commands (when they can find work at all) goes through the floor, even as the price of food goes through the roof. More people facing more and more desperate circumstances.
If Europe cannot cope with refugees from Syria - a country of 21 million - then our politicians need to think about what they will do when a country the size of Egypt (84 million and rising) disintegrates.
And never forget. The countries in the world with the highest numbers of births per woman are those where the biggest problem is violence. A couple of years ago those countries were Congo and Afghanistan. Presumably we'll see other countries join them in this not very desirable 1st rank in the world.
DeleteWHY? WHY? WHY? Would anyone want to target France? When France is such a peaceful nation and never hurt anyone. But history paints a different picture.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.rt.com/news/208599-french-polynesia-nuclear-tests/
http://www.greenpeace.org/international/en/about/history/the-bombing-of-the-rainbow-war/
Why is it that the public are the ones that take the brunt of the carnage the church and military have bestowed upon us.
To justify this type of spending, you have to have wars. The biggest problem on the planet is the military industrial complex. Here's a pie chart for the U.S
https://www.nationalpriorities.org/campaigns/military-spending-united-states/
Algeria. The first terrorist to be identified is an Algerian. My wife worked in Algeria during the height of their civil war. Around 100,000 people died in the fighting while she was there. It was brutal. France aligned against the fundamentalists.
DeleteIt goes back even further than that since Algeria was a colony of France until a rather bloody war of independence began in '54.
DeleteBut, the last time I checked the NYT two French nationals had been identified and one person who appeared to have had a Syrian passport, although it is not clear that the passport was genuine. But the descendants of Algerian immigrants who feel dispossessed in France does present a target rich environment for ISIS recruiting, as was seen from the Charlie Hebdo attacks last winter.
It goes back even further than that since Algeria was a colony of France until a rather bloody war of independence began in '54.
DeleteBut, the last time I checked the NYT two French nationals had been identified and one person who appeared to have had a Syrian passport, although it is not clear that the passport was genuine. But the descendants of Algerian immigrants who feel dispossessed in France does present a target rich environment for ISIS recruiting, as was seen from the Charlie Hebdo attacks last winter.
My wife worked in Algeria for several years during the civil war, but I am well aware of the revolution, and their love-hate relationship with France. My wife was there doing a job that had no reason to be there. They insisted a United States oil company had to have a contract administrator in the Sahara who was fully conversant in French. Most of the Algerians spoke some English, and were determined to converse in English. She was hoping to improve her French, but they wanted to better learn English.
DeleteBBC news, Tol does 180 turn around, 1.1C is the danger level
ReplyDeleteLink please
DeleteSociety 'to be hit by climate change'
Deletehttp://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-34800829
Meh. Tol sez "We're Doomed" so it's BAU all the way down...
"He says a rise of 4C would be undesirable but manageable for Europe and all nations rich enough to cope with the costs of adaptation. The best way of combating climate change, he told BBC News, was to maximise economic growth."
Ridley sez "Plant Food"
Transcript ...
DeleteIn Conversation: Roger Harrabin and Richard Tol
http://www.carbonbrief.org/in-conversation-roger-harrabin-and-richard-tol
I've written about the transcript now - with some quotes, and a contrast with the other Richard Tol:
Deletehttp://blog.hotwhopper.com/2015/11/will-real-richard-tol-please-stand-up.html
Let's see, we have the Cornwall Alliance, the intelligent-design thing, that weird Godwin episode from last year:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.desmogblog.com/2014/02/20/climate-change-denier-roy-spencer-says-people-who-use-word-denier-are-global-warming-nazis
.... and now this.
Spencer's image as a Brave Maverick Scientist Unafraid to Speak the Objective Truth In The Face Of A Massive Politically-Inspired Conspiracy looks to have lost every last shred of a fig-leaf of plausibility, except among fellow RWNJ-types. You don't see Schmidt or Mann or any of those other guys writing spittle-flecked tweets about world events that are only peripherally related to climate.
I am still trying to figure out how, in Spencer's imagination, gun control gets transformed into disarming the military. Does he think the British Army fights its enemies using bad language and legal writs?
DeleteMonty Python's army recruitment sketch comes to mind:
Deletehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOehDqygaj8
Millicent I will think you will find that all the British had in WWII was the element of surprise.
DeleteIt consisted of going BOO from behind a tree! Until the Americans arrived. Bert
That's an interesting analysis of the war concerning a power which maintained itself while greatly outnumbered for several years while the US sat on the sidelines due to isolationists.
DeleteThe correct term is 'sociopathy'.
ReplyDeleteIt wasn't a diagnosis so much as illustrative examples.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteJohn Jaeger's comment has been shifted to a more appropriate location. It can now be found at the HotWhoppery..
DeleteSou
Actually, I thought it was a pretty good example of where Denial is at - as their beloved 'pause' evaporates the rusted-on extremists simply double down on the same tired old 'it's a plot' nonsense. And pseudo-science word salad, of course...
DeleteThe pseudo-science word salad is hilarious.
DeleteI am trying to get my head round how you "add water vapour" to a graph showing the concentration of CO2 in the atmosphere.
This sort of hand-wavy allusion gets accepted at places like WUWT. Tends not to work in the real world.
John Jaeger appears to be saying that human carbon dioxide emissions are not adding to the atmospheric CO2 concentration over time, and that "natural" CO2 is responsible for the upward trend of the Keeling curve - with a bit of magical help from water vapour.
DeleteI'd love, love, love for him to produce the data that support his nonsensical statement!
I'm embarrassed to belong to the same species as people this stupid, or this mendacious. And if he's a poe, I'm still embarrassed that there is a proportion of the population so stupid/mendacious that the fact exists of difficulty in discerning between poe and poe-target...
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ReplyDeleteI've been thinking about the responses of the Denialati to the Paris bombings, and how they might affect the COP21 talks, and I'm wondering if in fact the attacks might actually focus the minds of the delegates on the risks and dangers of climate disruption, both from direct climate impacts and the knock-on political effects - as was a part of the Syrian mess.
ReplyDeleteWhatever the influence, I do hope that there is a substantial shift from the previous international political malaise. This is probably the last chance to do anything now that won't just be an effectively ad hoc mop-up after the fact...