tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post2307554616147880368..comments2024-03-25T05:30:23.847+11:00Comments on HotWhopper: Assaulting Reason: The Climate Inquisition and silencing science - with Tim Ball and Chuck WieseSouhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08818999735123752034noreply@blogger.comBlogger47125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-1207289082522598442016-06-14T16:14:56.339+10:002016-06-14T16:14:56.339+10:00Just want to thank Sue for the heads up on Chuck W...Just want to thank Sue for the heads up on Chuck Weise. Very useful ammunition. Anyone following the thread - I've done with him.Tony Bantonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-76943821628972178502016-03-17T08:50:55.043+11:002016-03-17T08:50:55.043+11:00The problem is, in the wacky world of science deni...The problem is, in the wacky world of science denial - to those trying to counter the avalanche of crap they produce - you inevitably get drawn into a pointless argument debating some esoteric point on the fringes of science <br /><br />The central point gets lost in the noise, the act of creating "noise" represents a victory in denierland - it keeps the conversation alive <br /><br />They tie you up in their pseudo science - pseudo science that takes a second to construct but hours to refute <br /><br />The tactic is to keep the debate going, to a point the existence of this blog (thank you Sou) is a testament of the effectiveness of this strategy <br /><br />But I think as "nature" simply fails to enter the debate, more and more this conversation will become an intriguing footnote in humans ability for self delusion <br /><br />Tadaaahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07736188830660481871noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-9985012692376315392016-03-17T07:27:13.318+11:002016-03-17T07:27:13.318+11:00Yes, you did deflect. No point doubling up on your...Yes, you did deflect. No point doubling up on your deflection.<br /><br />If you really want to engage answer Sou's questions - how would you start a dialogue with someone who says CO2 does not drive the climate? If you do not like the question it only takes a little imagination to move the dialogue to the science you believe Chuck is espousing. You could start by showing you understand the several pages of maths he has so patiently put together. You could explain how it is relevant to his hypothesis, whatever that is.<br /><br />Jammy Dodgerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08360437479098314946noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-46490296407448992822016-03-17T07:20:15.698+11:002016-03-17T07:20:15.698+11:00This comment has been removed by the author.Sound Science Needs No Lieshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01119596598479161612noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-16424925250697805582016-03-17T06:50:22.705+11:002016-03-17T06:50:22.705+11:00Anonymous
Please show us how to focus and engage....Anonymous<br /><br />Please show us how to focus and engage. By focussing and engaging yourself!<br /><br />Sou offered a couple of talking points which you deflected. And fair enough - you may not want to start with those. But if you do not put up a discussable point of your own then you are showing an inability to focus and engage.<br />Jammy Dodgerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08360437479098314946noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-84075147966437298082016-03-17T06:22:22.469+11:002016-03-17T06:22:22.469+11:00Deflection and avoidance. About what I expected, w...Deflection and avoidance. About what I expected, with the added bonuses of sides plus the word science in quotation marks.Souhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08818999735123752034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-10690099694074061982016-03-17T06:12:12.125+11:002016-03-17T06:12:12.125+11:00Are you really curious or are you just pretending....Are you really curious or are you just pretending. <br />Because it is exceedingly obvious that there is much more than the declarations you wish to dismiss. <br />You're making my point about inability to focus and engage.<br />Wiese was abundantly thorough in providing the "science" behind his analysis which your side is always accusing skeptics of failing to address or consider.<br />Which is it. You do want the science front and center for discussion or you do not. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-495514319862512902016-03-17T05:54:02.757+11:002016-03-17T05:54:02.757+11:00Out of curiosity, how would you propose to begin a...Out of curiosity, how would you propose to begin a dialogue with <a href="http://www.ametsoc.org/chapters/oregon/Minutes/2012/2012_1_25_Meeting/2012_1_25_Minutes.html" rel="nofollow">someone who says</a> "CO2 does not drive the earth's climate" and "The Anthropogenic warming hypothesis by atmospheric CO2 is falsified by the real record and radiation physics"? Moreover, why would you want to waste your breath?Souhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08818999735123752034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-18602752628740142232016-03-17T05:24:11.568+11:002016-03-17T05:24:11.568+11:00It's not surprising none of you exhibit any un...It's not surprising none of you exhibit any understanding of or interest in the science Chuck presented. Your knee jerk dismissal of it as opinion unworthy of your consumption says it all about who is truly interested in the science. <br /><br />Without explanation we are left to assume there some fear element to your chronic avoidance of focus and dialogue that progresses? <br />What's so tough about focus? Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-13745124712719619602016-03-16T03:00:12.662+11:002016-03-16T03:00:12.662+11:00Too true -
challenge their worldview
faith in unq...Too true - <br />challenge their worldview<br />faith in unquestionable certitudes and all that...<br /><br />Worse it's about an absolute disinterest in learning about this planet/biosphere that we depend on for everything.<br />(It's that disconnect that I struggle with the most, how to spark an interest in this ultimately fascinating Earth, it's process and it's incredible life story?)citizenschallengehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04559990934735912814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-22750860537744949592016-03-16T02:01:01.966+11:002016-03-16T02:01:01.966+11:00@citizenschallenge
the simple fact is that it is ...@citizenschallenge<br /><br />the simple fact is that it is not about the science <br /><br />it is about a challenge to their worldview Tadaaahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07736188830660481871noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-15626922072221205982016-03-16T01:59:55.850+11:002016-03-16T01:59:55.850+11:00This comment has been removed by the author.Tadaaahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07736188830660481871noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-88809585981699792092016-03-16T01:44:07.409+11:002016-03-16T01:44:07.409+11:00Of course, the reply to such a letter should follo...Of course, the reply to such a letter should follow the precedent of "We refer you to the reply given in the case of Arkell v. Pressdram" jrkrideauhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04869979887929067657noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-16637276552990256362016-03-16T01:40:48.964+11:002016-03-16T01:40:48.964+11:00"Trust us, we're experts" by Rampton..."Trust us, we're experts" by Rampton & Stauber will inform you entirely. cRR Kampenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07571285063752477448noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-46712728356125514912016-03-16T01:22:34.447+11:002016-03-16T01:22:34.447+11:00What I find most heartbreaking about all this, is ...What I find most heartbreaking about all this, is that there seems no moral standard of honesty amongst the Climate Science Denying Crowd. They feel fully within their "Rights" to blatantly lie about established facts and studies - and everyone else just plays a long. (… jumping to the whistle they blow.)<br /><br />I don't get it.citizenschallengehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04559990934735912814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-35951301003890817762016-03-15T23:30:11.169+11:002016-03-15T23:30:11.169+11:00Francis's arguments are correct. Very, very me...Francis's arguments are correct. Very, very measurably so. I call it 'Stuck Pattern Syndrome'.<br />They also are among the most important and acute climate changes there exist - prolonging both droughts and wet spells. <br />There is more to Arctic (northern hemisphere) Amplification though, since the southern hemisphere seems to arrive in 'Stuck Pattern Syndrome' in recent years too. Check the peculiar prolonged heat waves in Australia in areas where a see saw with a period of four or five days used to characterize the regime. cRR Kampenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07571285063752477448noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-34963659661606592972016-03-15T22:15:28.874+11:002016-03-15T22:15:28.874+11:00I know - it was a whimsical comment really, but ne...I know - it was a whimsical comment really, but nevertheless as the posters at WUWT get ever more conspiratorial it would allow some acceptance of the data without compromising the "new world order" "agenda 21 one world government" claptrap - the great thing about conspiracies is that they just expand to accommodate any new data / evidence<br /><br />and it keeps the traffic up!! Tadaaahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07736188830660481871noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-84634069453789336582016-03-15T22:14:55.167+11:002016-03-15T22:14:55.167+11:00This comment has been removed by the author.Tadaaahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07736188830660481871noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-77266684722307064642016-03-15T16:48:11.392+11:002016-03-15T16:48:11.392+11:00I don't get to Oregon as often as I like, but ...I don't get to Oregon as often as I like, but I did gather that those three are often in cahoots. Rest assured, I can think of much better reasons to visit than to check out their shenanigans.<br /><br />Wiese might be a perfectly fine meteorologist -- OSU is not a crappy school. His ideas on climate are thoroughly bonkers so far as I've read.Brandon R. Gateshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17031044715994785956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-15955228236522926922016-03-15T16:32:33.734+11:002016-03-15T16:32:33.734+11:00Brandon, before I even went and looked at the AMS ...Brandon, before I even went and looked at the AMS meeting minutes you cited I guessed who the other two were. Gordon Fulks and George Taylor along with Chuck Wiese are all well known entities of the denier circle in Oregon. I've interacted with both of them over the years.<br /><br />BTW some were asking about Chuck Wiese's academic qualifications. I believe he has a BA in Meteorology from Oregon State University.riveratnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-16466029173132676062016-03-15T13:41:11.459+11:002016-03-15T13:41:11.459+11:00David, it just struck me as a shockingly content-l...David, it just struck me as a shockingly content-less swipe at Dr. Francis.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-54206560838073726302016-03-15T11:04:43.882+11:002016-03-15T11:04:43.882+11:00wheelism: I wasn't judging, just repeating wha...wheelism: I wasn't judging, just repeating what I heard. I didn't mean it as a proof or disproof of Weise. David Appellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03318269033139447591noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-27609293919135656822016-03-15T10:57:35.883+11:002016-03-15T10:57:35.883+11:00"I recently talked to someone who was recentl..."I recently talked to someone who was recently a postdoc at Rutgers. We didn't get into many details, but he told me that it's pretty well accepted now that Jennifer Francis's ideas aren't correct."<br /><br />If I may be so bold, that's an awfully anecdotal judgement to drop as a segue into a Chuck Wiese dismissal. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-36466458632190191502016-03-15T10:19:01.250+11:002016-03-15T10:19:01.250+11:00Chemtrails run counter to Anthony's odd sense ...Chemtrails run counter to Anthony's odd sense of respectable credibility. Geoengineering would be a tacit admission that we're actually having a noticeable effect on climate and that we can and should do something about it.Brandon R. Gateshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17031044715994785956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2313427464944392482.post-20530992406092460332016-03-15T10:15:21.316+11:002016-03-15T10:15:21.316+11:00[chortle][chortle]Brandon R. Gateshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17031044715994785956noreply@blogger.com